Margherita tells us about her college app process applying as a student who attended a French school in the United States. She talks about the harsh French system and how her high school differed greatly from a traditional American public high school.

Part 2 is here.

Transcription

Kamila
Hey, college kids, welcome back to my podcast who cares about college. In today’s episode, I’ll be interviewing Margarita. So if you could introduce yourself.

Margherita
Hi, my name is Margarita, I’m Spanish, Italian. But I grew up in New York City, and I go to Brown University. I’m now a junior studying philosophy and political science.

Kamila
Alright, so you kind of went into it already. But can you quickly share your race as at least how you were applying your race, your gender and your socio economic status? Like, no, I guess low income, middle class, upper middle, high class.

Margherita
Um, so I identify as female I use she her hers pronouns. Um, I am Spanish, Italian. So but I grew up in New York City. So I think I applied, I’m white. But it is a little complicated in the United States, because they do ask you if you’re Hispanic or Latino, and they include Spanish in that. So I guess I applied as Hispanic parentheses Spanish, which is different from Hispanic parentheses, Latin America. And then I think I’d qualify as either middle or upper middle class. So meaning I got like, either very little or no financial aid. But that was still a big factor in how I chose colleges.

Kamila
We’ll probably talk about that later. Yep. So you were telling me a little bit earlier, school that you went to was a bit different? So can you please describe to us the kind of school that you went to? And you said, you didn’t have exactly a GPA? So can you explain how they, I guess, arranged their curriculum in comparison to a normal high school?

Margherita
Yeah, I went to a French school in New York City, which means that I followed the French system. So I followed the exact same type, same type of schooling as any other teenager in France would. So I had the Becca louia, instead of like, AP and honors classes. So and which means I was also graded a little bit different, it’s out of 20, instead of out of 100. French, the French system is also notoriously quite harsh. So getting like 60 80%. So like 14 or 12, is not that bad. Whereas I know that like getting a 60% in the US fail, failing that class. So my high school was a little bit different. And all of those different factors had to be prorated, or like, translated or switched over, when I did want to apply to American schools.

Kamila
And is there a reason why you or your family decided to put you in into a French school in high school? Was it something you did throughout elementary middle, and you just continue to into?

Margherita
Yeah, I always went to a French school. I’m not French, but the French system is quite rigorous, and also quite similar to the Spanish Italian one. And when I was a little kid, my parents didn’t know if I’d stay in the United States my whole life, or if we’d go back to Europe, so ever since elementary school, I was in a French school. And I just stayed there until I graduated.

Kamila
Okay, and asked for the grading system, or like, I guess how they do the advanced placement courses? Can you describe the cut? What was the name you gave for the advanced courses?

Margherita
So there aren’t advanced courses actually, in the French system. All of our courses, we basically have no freedom. Everyone has to take four years of math, four years of English, four years of French four years of the second and third language four years of science, there’s no choice. And there aren’t really, they do separate us sometimes, like there is a more rigorous class and a less rigorous class for like math sometimes. But that’s also not something we choose, we’re just placed into it. And it doesn’t even show up differently in our transcripts. So we didn’t really have what I know in a lot of American schools, there’s like AP and honors and regular classes. We didn’t have any of that.

Kamila
So it was all standardized. You guys, we everyone just took the same classes in the same grade. Yeah,

Margherita
more or less, you did have an element of choice where you could choose if you wanted to do more literary stuff, more scientific stuff, or more policy econ stuff. But that just impacted how many hours of that class you had. So you’d have more math hours, like five instead of three. That didn’t actually impact how it showed up on your transcript as honors or IPs or whatever. Everything did look kind of standard.

Kamila
Okay, and when you were, I guess when they switched it when you’re applying to American schools. Actually, I have one more question when you’re going to a school like you or like you did a French school? That that was like mirroring the French system or just any other school like that. Do you like? I don’t know, do schools in France recognize your high school? When they have like applicants? Is that like normal for people at your school to apply to schools in France?

Margherita
Yeah, I think maybe I want to say a third of my school stayed in the United States, but the others either a substantial amount went to Canada, because they also have a French American culture there. And then I say, a third go back to France, or like Spain, Italy, Germany, UK is a big one as well. So like 75 70% of people went back to Europe, and then the rest stayed here in the US. Yeah. Okay. So

Kamila
let’s go on to your grades. You said the scaling was quite different at your school, but when they translated it to the, I guess, the American system, what did your GPA or your overall grade

Margherita
so when it was translated, my grades which were numbers, so it was like I said, it was graded out of 20. And your final grade would be like 14 or 16, or 15. If it was a 14 or above, you automatically had an AP class. So I ended up with straight A’s or straight A pluses. But a lot of people in my school did. So most a substantial amount of people in my in my school ended up with four point O’s because they kind of overcorrected. The translation. The French system is so harsh that when you translate it, it’s it almost becomes too lenient.

Kamila
Harsh, like, like you said, a 14 out of 20. Like, we would freak out if we got that here. But why is that normal? Like? Do they give you a lot of work? Is the material really advanced?

Margherita
Yeah, I think the expectation there, I think it’s, it comes down to cultural differences. I think in France, you want to be really tough on the students and kind of challenge them with the assumption that they won’t be able to do everything that’s on the test. But In trying to do things, you challenge them to kind of like figure things out for themselves. Yeah, I think it’s just a very big cultural difference. Just people are more vigorous or a little bit more harsh abroad. Yeah.

Kamila
Oh, wow. That’s amazing. Okay, so when, and I just have to ask when you’re taking your courses, and when a college when a college sees your transcript for us, they know like, oh, this person took six APS, this person took nine APS, when they were viewing your transcript. And they have, you know, because you don’t know what the college admissions officer said, right. But when they’re viewing your transcript, and they saw that you went to a French school, obviously, the stuff is translated. But in terms of like the classes, how do they know how rigorous your classes were, if there’s no label on them, like AP honor, GT or IV?

Margherita
That’s a great question. Um, a lot of it comes down to the fact that admissions officers know our school, or at the very least, they know different schooling systems. The French one is kind of notoriously, it’s kind of like the IB International Baccalaureate, if you do the IB, that’s also seen as quite rigorous. And so I think my experience kind of highlights the fact that you shouldn’t worry too much, if you’re in an unconventional school where you don’t have AP, or honors, admissions officers know about that they know about the differences. And even the fact that, for example, in my school, so many people ended up with pretty high GPAs, because of the conversion, that was maybe not the most accurate conversion. Again, admissions officers know about that, right? If you have a 3.5, from a really, really tough school where no one has a 4.0, they’re going to not take that 3.5 and look at it negatively, they’re gonna think it’s a positive and vice versa, if everyone has a 4.0, like, in my case, they’re also gonna underscore that element of your application a little bit. So I don’t think people should worry too much about that.

Kamila
So the basically colleges that you’re applying to kind of knew of your school at least, and how they how the system went,

Margherita
yeah, if not my school, definitely the French system. There’s international application officers who know about most countries that usually apply. Turkey, Lebanon, France, UK, the at least the very common ones. So yeah, they knew either of my school or the French system in general.

Kamila
Interesting, and let’s go on to sa t AC T. You did say you took one of those. You said that? took the LSAT. Okay, so with the LSAT, what kind of preparations did you do? When did you start your preparations? And then in the end, what was your super score?

Margherita
So I did not have a very conventional sad experience either. My parents being immigrants did not know anything about the sh t and we’re just like figure it out. So I just got a textbook and study it. I was on KhanAcademy. And then I had this like practice book with some practices ETS. I spent, I never had like a tutor or anything. And I spent maybe like, one month over the summer just like really practicing at it. And then my school would host some in person practice test, like every other month. But other than that, I just studied that one month in summer kind of rigorously, and then took it I got a 1550 and never took it again. On

Kamila
the first try. I got 1550. Yeah. You just say you just you just did Han Academy went into the in person. tests at your school?

Margherita
Yeah. All right. Well, I think testing yourself on like a real time conditions really helps.

Kamila
I was 1550 on your first trial, it’s like only a couple wrong. Okay.

Margherita
I don’t know how much of your demographic is non American, but for the non Americans out there, I think one of the more difficult things was if you do schooling, not in English, so like math, for example, I’d always done it in French. It was just the translation that was kind of difficult doing math in English for the first time and realizing like, Oh, these terms don’t mean the same thing. This DRM is different in English, as opposed to I’m French, things like that. That was probably the hardest part, honestly.

Kamila
So you do your entire schooling in French. And then did you guys have like one English class throughout the day?

Margherita
Yeah, we had English class, which was in English, obviously. And then as you got older, you could choose to take certain classes like history, geography, you could choose to take it in English, or in French, but you were still learning mainly French history.

Kamila
That’s Oh, so you were learning? Okay, that’s, that’s amazing. This is fastly? I’ve never heard of such schools, like international schools, but in the United States. Okay. So before we get on to other parts, like the extracurriculars and your actual application, when you were going into high school, did you have any expectation? Like, did you ever set your mind on like, oh, I want to go to a top university in America? Oh, I want to consider going to France and during schooling, they are going to Canada and doing University. They’re like, what? What were you thinking when you came into high school.

Margherita
So because the because university in the US is so expensive, I kind of approached it. Like, if I get into a top university in the United States, it’s also my parents who were saying this, my parents were saying, If I got into a top university in the United States that they’d pay for it. But if it wasn’t a top university, then I should just go back to Europe where it’s free, or at least extremely cheap. So I always went into it apply under the guise of like, I’ll apply to great schools in the US. And then my quote, unquote, safeties that weren’t that safety. They were all abroad. So mainly UK, I applied in the UK, and then in the US as like my quote, unquote, reach schools, I guess.

Kamila
And were there any sort of standardized test or requirements that you needed to do for these international schools, like, you know, UK or other countries in Europe.

Margherita
So the French Baccalaureate is like our end of year exam, end of high school exam, it’s like the British A levels. I don’t know if you know what those are.

Kamila
I can’t understand them for the life of me.

Margherita
But it just these end of year exams, that is, again, quite rigorous, just to pass it, you need a 50%. So most people get, you know, 5060 70% is not that bad. In fact, if you get an 80%, you get a if you get a 16 out of 20, you get like a mansion that says very well done. So like 80% Very well.

Kamila
I even see that universities, for people in the UK. They’re like, Oh, my God, I got a 70 on my final grade. I’m like, is that good? Is that accepted?

Margherita
It? Yeah. And so based on the way that it works in the UK, I think this might, I don’t know if you guys noticed, but this is very unconventional for US schools, I think it might be kind of surprising. They use that final grade as a condition. So they’ll say we accept you on the condition that you get a 15 on your final baccalaureate. And so I have some friends who didn’t reach that condition and couldn’t end up going to the college that they wanted to.

Kamila
What did they make that condition based off of? How do they determine the number for you? Oh, they

Margherita
know what your average is before. Like, my average school was like 18 or 19, or whatever. And then they’re like, based on that your final Baccalaureate grade should be 15 or 16, or 12. You know, and then if you reach it, you get accepted. And if you don’t, you can apply to two schools. Sorry, you can accept two schools. So usually you accept one with a really high condition and one with a low condition or no condition and you fall back on that one if you don’t reach your first choice condition and what was your condition? Um, I do not remember if I had a condition because I had pretty good grades in high school. So if you had good grades In high school that increase the likelihood that you didn’t have a high condition or any condition at all. So maybe my condition, I think maybe one of the schools I got accepted in, I had a 12 or 14 condition.

Kamila
Just okay. Yeah, we’re going to get into those other schools I applied to a little bit later. Let’s just get onto extracurricular. So, extracurriculars. Did you approach them just like any other US student? Were there clubs at your school? You know, sports at your school that you did?

Margherita
Yeah. So because we were in a French school, a lot of the clubs that we have were less, I’d say rigorous, like, our version of the debate team was just meeting once a week in a classroom and debating, like, our teacher would just be like, what’s better Christmas or fall? Debate? So it wasn’t as competitive. There weren’t like very big national leagues or anything like that. But I was on the soccer team for four years. I was on the debate team for four years. I did Model UN am my Model UN and Harvard Model Congress. That was a little bit more established. I guess. We actually went to Harvard to do this, like Model Congress thing. Um, what else did I do? I played piano on the side, I was editor in chief of my school newspaper. I started my own little club, where we basically got together, honestly, it ended up just being my friends getting together. And we called it Mr. Newell, which is like a reference to the Renaissance, where there’d be the center rooms where philosophers would come in and discuss ideas. It was kind of like a philosophy club. So yeah, I kept pretty busy in high school.

Kamila
So I want to go through each of your extracurriculars and like what role you play and like, you know how long you did them for? So with soccer? How long did you do for them? What position did you make it to like, Junior verse, I

Margherita
played for glory. And I was pretty terrible. I played an attack. And I only scored one goal over the course of the four years. So I wasn’t really high up, but I was that one was mainly just for myself to play something to have fun, to be honest. So not everything you do in high school has to be for college admission, as pretty terrible.

Kamila
And you did mention some clubs that were that are just like other American high schools. You said Harvard? Try on Andreas, mono calm.

Margherita
I did mock trial in college. That’s why I messed up. Sorry, I didn’t Model UN and Model Congress in high school.

Kamila
Can you tell us about the Harvard Model Congress? Is it like some sort of partnership your school has with Harvard to do this?

Margherita
Yeah, Harvard puts it on. So I think Harvard students put it on. And it’s like a Model Congress, you simulate like congressmen in the house or in the Senate. And they give you a topic and you have to go there pretend to be a senator or Congress person and debate it. And I think Harvard puts on the competition. So many US schools will go to Harvard when they host their tournament and just be part of competition.

Kamila
Because that’s interesting. Do they give you like a certain issue and you have to spend the school year like gathering and making your argument and then you go to Congress?

Margherita
It’s not that rigorous, I don’t think I think we’d spent maybe a couple months, not like the whole year preparing. I think mine was about like, negative interest rates, which I did not know anything about. And we were all incredibly unqualified to be debating, like, it’s just a bunch of 16 year olds, pretending like we knew economic policy. But yeah, you just went there. It was fun. It was like the intersection of like, pretending to be a politician, so kind of theatrical, and also debating your policy. And it’s also interesting, because, for example, I got a Republican, which is not how I lean usually. So I had to get up there and be like, super patriotic, and a Republican, and advocate for the viewpoints of the person I was representing. Not necessarily myself.

Kamila
That’s hard. So the exact opposite was you. Okay. And with that model, Congress was it was like a competition or more like a fun thing. Like, did certain schools win prizes or win? Yeah. Yeah, I

Margherita
think I mean, it is a competition. It was also fun. I got a I think I got Yeah, I got like an award. I don’t know what it was maybe like, good Congressman award, basically, per committee are usually like different committees. And there’s a couple people who get awarded. No, I don’t think it was a huge part of my application. But I got an award. Yeah. Right.

Kamila
And next one, too. I think you said Model UN. And I do. I’m not part of Model UN. But I do have friends. And they do have some competitions. They go to like they go to the nearest city to us. And they actually compete for a couple days, I think in the year. So can you describe what you did with Model UN and what position did you hold in the club?

Margherita
Yeah, so I’m kind of similar to Model Congress. I didn’t Model UN In my freshman year, and then I didn’t Model Congress the next year, so I only didn’t want you in a year. We since I grew up in New York City, it was kind of nice because we, our Model UN was at the United Nations Headquarters in New York. And we went, and we just, once again, we got a country, and we had to research that countries position on a certain topic. I actually got the United States. And we had to advocate on behalf of the US on issues about privacy versus security, which was once again, quite interesting, because I do not agree with the US policy on how much the other collecting on us. But we had to go in there and be like, Look, we’re defenders of freedom. We need to read everyone’s privacy for the security of the world, obviously. So yeah, you just go into the UN and you advocate for the position of the country you’re assigned. Usually you don’t get the US usually you get like, Azerbaijan or something. You get a smaller country. Wait, yeah.

Kamila
And does the so you said the United Nations Headquarters, like the place that you’re going to do they look at all the schools that are gonna be participating, and then give each school a different one? Like, how do they decide which school you get? Which country you get?

Margherita
I actually have no clue. I think because it was high school. It was our teachers who were organizing all the logistics. So I wasn’t really involved in like which tournament we went to or not, I think it’s just if you are already, if you’re in a school that’s based in New York City, you probably do the Model Congress in that New York City headquarters. Since we’re there. Since we’re right next to the UN, it’s just 20 blocks down our school.

Kamila
Okay, and what other extracurriculars you did? You mentioned, you mentioned that you started your own clubs, or can you describe the process of that?

Margherita
Yeah, it was pretty easy at my school, because once again, it was a fringe school. So they were just kind of like, Yeah, do it yourself. So long as we said, we wanted to do something they let us. So my friend and I started this club, where it was essentially like a debate club, but it was more about like, um, first getting the facts. So like, we do a little bit in the beginning, like 15 minutes of like, a fact sheet. Like for the gun issue, we would, we had to like a fact sheet about gun statistics, we had a topic about gun violence in the United States. And so there was like a fact sheet with like, different facts that was kind of balanced on both sides, like pro and con. And then we’d spent the next like, 45 minutes discussing that. So it was a little bit kind of like debate,

Kamila
but it was more, it was less question. It wasn’t like trying to win.

Margherita
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So that was really fun. But again, that just turned into our friends coming in eating cookies and discussing things. It wasn’t as impactful as other clubs. Yes. Oh, and I did Student Council, that was a really big thing that I did.

Kamila
Well, we have to know the really big things. Okay. Tell me about student council. How long did you do for and what was student council at your school? Was it like, you know, managing the schools like events? Or was it more like you representing your school in the county or something?

Margherita
Yeah, so I did student council for four years and eventually became the president of the Student Council. And then within the student council, there was like, a very small group, like three, maybe five people, three or five people who also were on a board, kind of like a school board that included students, I was one of the three or five students. I’m the director of our school teachers of our school and parents. And those were the people who made policy decisions by policy. I mean, like, academic calendar, academic policies, dress code, things like that. So I was part of part of student council and that other thing for all four years.

Kamila
So what did the members who were not part of the, like the big committee that you were talking about, what did they do? What role did they play? If you were not one of those like three five students?

Margherita
So we had a lot of things that we did we establish the policies that will you want it the other people in the smaller committee to advocate for. We also we had a budget, kind of small looking back on it, like two or $4,000, which sounds like a lot, but then you get like a lot to a high schooler. It is. Then you get to university and I think Browns at Brown, the UCs, the Undergraduate Council students has like a $3 million budget. So that really changes your perspective. Yeah. Um, so we had a budget, we were like, Let’s replace the chairs up. Honestly, the main thing we did was like advocate for our peers. So like, oh, this academic calendar is really bad. We have no breaks and people are suffering or like, wow, the chairs in this sound are really bad or

Kamila
Hey, so you guys were like The student perspective telling the directors and the parents

Margherita
Yeah, exactly. Sorry. Um, yeah. And I really like that. I think I always I do Polly sign now I always wanted to get kind of in politics and that was like a little mini version of politicking for me where I was there arguing with people were the president of the school or whatever. And I had fun.

Kamila
I would love to argue with some older adults too. All right, and when? And just so quick question, I guess about your school. So you say you went to a French school? Was it part of a county in New York? Or was it just its own thing?

Margherita
It was a private school. So it’s, it’s in New York City? It’s on the Upper East Side, but it was a private school, so I don’t know. Um, yeah.

Kamila
Obviously, there wasn’t like a bigger county like, administration that like directed the schools. Oh, it was just you and your school now.

Margherita
Exactly. We did follow the guidance of public schools, for example, snow days, we did whatever public schools did, but like calendars, policies, whatever it was up to our school to independently impose.

Kamila
Oh, wow. Okay. That’s, that’s very interesting. Your schools? Sounds really, because I’ve never interviewed someone from such a school. Okay. And just to make it clear in your school, like I, I don’t know, an American school. I mean, I’m an American school, and they stress academics and extracurriculars like pretty equally, at least at my school for you was a kind of like, the academics were hardcore and rigorous and the extracurriculars they were more laid back on.

Margherita
Um, yeah, a little bit. I think that’s what it would be if you were actually in France, if you were actually in France, you in school at 6pm. You go home and you sleep, or like you do work, and then you go to sleep there, there isn’t really that big focus. Since we were in New York City, there were more extracurricular offerings. But it was super common for people there like last year or last two years of high school quitting something like the soccer team because they wanted to focus on their baccalaureate that like focus on extracurriculars is really American. And I think unless you wanted to go to a US college, or unless you were, like really passionate about it. Most people didn’t do as many extracurriculars as many other American students. Like I was editor in chief of this newspaper, and I was on the student council, and I did a lot of extracurriculars. But that was definitely not the norm. Most people did a couple of things, and then went home.

Kamila
Were your parents ever confused? Like, what are these extracurriculars that you’re doing? You should just be focusing on school.

Margherita
Um, my mom’s very, very chill. So she was just kind of like, so long as you have your good grades, and so long as you’re happy, do whatever you want. Yeah, also, this is unrelated. But I had like little jobs that I do, like, I was a tutor, and I was a babysitter. And I know that those aren’t like the most integral. Part two is college applications. But I think that those jobs did teach me a lot about like, maturity, responsibility, just harness a lot of skills that are really useful. And so even things like that you can mention in your application, and especially if you’re coming from a very different background, like lower socio economic status, definitely highlight those because they’re still valuable. And if you’re putting a lot of time into that, to make money, that’s also incredibly valid. And you should still, like just because it’s not an extracurricular in the conventional sense, doesn’t mean that you didn’t get a lot of great skills that will be highly, like perceived super highly by the admissions office.

Kamila
Okay, and one more extracurriculars that you talked about that seem like kind of big was editor in chief, again, as we’ve been doing? Can you describe, you know, when you started, how you like, I guess, climbed yourself up to that role? And what were your responsibilities as editor in chief?

Margherita
Um, so I started by writing an article that was like about sexism in my school. So I started off with a bang and just continued on with the thing, whenever I get annoyed, I just write something like they changed the, like, branding of my school, and I thought that it was super disingenuous, and kind of like a cash grab. So I wrote an article about it. And since I was editor in chief, I put myself on the front. So I really I like definitely angered the administration. I had like a couple I also wrote an article about why kids should skip school. Because I thought that people were like, so obsessed with their academics that they shouldn’t be afraid to, like, sometimes skip school and like do others. Like I skipped a couple days of school to go to work on a a midterm campaigns when the midterms happened in 2018. And so I had to skip school a couple of times to work on that campaign and Staten Island. And a lot of people were really judgmental about that because they’re like, how could you sacrifice your academics to like, and so I wrote this article basically being like, there are other learning and educational experiences that are not within the classroom and you should Don’t be so afraid of like a missing one day of school, you have such

Kamila
an American mindset? Because Because you’re describing the academics, you sound like you call them out. Okay? How did you not lose your position?

Margherita
I didn’t lose my position. But they tried to like stop me from printing it. And so I had to go to like, I had a talk with the with the director of our school. And then he read the article. And it was kind of nuanced. Like I added a paragraph, they made me add a paragraph that was like, but also, if you party on the weekends, then that’s not a valid excuse to skip school, which was like, so pedantic and unnecessary, but whatever. So I started off my links, links as the name of the newspaper career by like, whenever I get annoyed, I just write for the newspaper. And eventually, I, I don’t know when I think probably when I was a freshman, I became one of the editors in chief. And I stayed until my senior year, and I just had to, like, read every article and edit them.

Kamila
And it was just articles more related to your school like policies that your school released and such.

Margherita
No, there were students who wrote about anything. Wow, students who wrote like, oh, it was a volcano eruption, or, Oh, this MacBook is really interesting. Or then mine that are like, Oh, controversial. I studied abroad. And that too, I like, this experience was really cool. This is why you should do it. It was it was a really cool experience. Like, I mean, I enjoyed it. That’s

Kamila
why I say, Oh, it sounds like you enjoyed us. I mean, I would love to just like, type and release anything. Amazing. I’m surprised you to lose your position. First of all, like, I feel like most schools, if you call them out like that, they’d be like, No, yeah,

Margherita
I think maybe that’s a little bit the French in them that they’re like, Oh, she’s annoying, but she has a point. They’re like, they’re not gonna restrict you as much as US schools, I think. I don’t know. I guess like, I can’t be the best judge since I didn’t go to a US school.

Kamila
I’m telling you. I think they wouldn’t allow that.

Margherita
Yeah, it sounds like, it sounds like our school was a little bit more liberal. I’m

Kamila
not sure. Okay, so let’s go on to, I guess, the actual call, because we’ve gone through a few of your extracurriculars. Unless you want to elaborate on more any more extracurriculars. Now. Okay. So let’s move on to that application portion. So you said you were considering some international schools in Europe. So let’s first get that like out of the way in the application for that, and then we can get on to the US application.

Margherita
So can you describe the you can see, it’s really straightforward. It’s something called the UCaaS. And you’re bound to five schools. So you have to choose five schools to apply to, and you write one essay for all five of those schools,

Kamila
about one.

Margherita
Basically, you have to apply for a particular subject. So in my case, I applied for, I think PPE, politics, philosophy, economics. And so you write one essay that is not at all like the USA, it’s really academic. And it’s like, look how smart I am. I got these test scores, I read these books, I did these clubs that will help me be the best politician or these clubs, that will be me, the best scientists. And that’s it. Right? It’s like I read these books.

Kamila
So you’re literally just putting your achievements on a paper. Yes. My like, personal statement like they’re doing us.

Margherita
Yeah, not at all. And so it’s one page, it’s like, look at all the things I’ve done. This is why I’m so smart. This is why I’m so well read, and this is why I will be the best blank.

Kamila
Is it even an essay? Or is it more of a resume? Like are you actually writing a paragraph?

Margherita
Yeah, it’s an essay. And that gets sent to all five schools, and then they get back to you like, it’s really, really straightforward. Um, and then there’s the US application, that’s obviously like, so long and what you did did you apply to any French schools? No, I just applied to the UK ones and to the American ones,

Kamila
and which UK schools did you apply to?

Margherita
I mean, I remember it the spine, and I applied to Oxford. Um, I applied to, I think, UCL University College London, LSE, London School of Economics, Manchester University. And then another, I can’t remember, there’s that I just filled up the five boxes.

Kamila
And when you say you’re bound to these five schools, if a student doesn’t get into any of those schools, do they wait till like next year?

Margherita
Yeah, I guess I don’t think that’s super common. The acceptance rates in because you because everyone is bound to the five schools. That makes all acceptance rates higher, if that makes sense. Like you won’t get as many applicants so proportionately there’s more acceptances. So I don’t think it’s super you. It also forces students to be a little bit more realistic, and be like, Look, I probably won’t get into if I applied to all five that are super competitive. In fact, you’re not allowed to apply to Oxford and Cambridge. You have to be one of the two. So they make it so that all universities are less competitive, but also you can’t apply to as many.

Kamila
Okay, okay, so of the schools that you apply to in the UK, which ones did you get accepted or rejected from? And if there’s like a waitlist then mentioned that

Margherita
I also do not. I know that I got into Manchester and that was like my big one that it’s like, okay, I got Manchester now I can apply to the US schools. And if that doesn’t work out, I’ll just go to Manchester. I think I got into either UCL or LSE. I think it was like a conditional thing. But I think I got to just acceptance offers. I think I also applied wrong to one of those two, like I applied for one program, but my essay was, like I applied to a law program. Even though my essay was about politics. I got disqualified just based off of that, which was just, no one told me I couldn’t do that for my college counselor should have told me but he didn’t. So whatever. And then I didn’t get into Oxford. But again, I think, like, we were just really unprepared in my school, like there was this test and everything that we had no clue about. And we just got to school, and our school was like, Oh, wait, you have to take this test. So all of us had to take one unprepared. So yeah, we didn’t have the best college advising in my opinion. But um, yeah, so I didn’t get into Oxford. But I still took the I still got a couple other offers that ended up not being super memorable, obviously. Well,

Kamila
and just for comparison’s, cuz I mean, people listening to this podcast, I they’re mostly American, so they know how the American school system works, and how expensive the colleges can get like private schools. I mean, you’re paying the what is it? The sticker price is like, 70,000 something right? But in comparison, can you just tell us what these UK schools would cost for an international student like you?

Margherita
So I’m not entirely sure, just because I never actually, again, my circumstances are a little bit different. Since I’m an EU citizen, I think I would have a, I wouldn’t pay as much as an American citizen. But also, now that there’s Brexit, that’s also changing. So it’s really complicated. But I do, I think it’d be something around like 20k for an international student, maybe like 27k, or something like that, which is still a lot, but it’s substantially less. And also, this is like, kind of a side note, but in terms of quality of life, like dorms and stuff. If you go to the UK, you get like a private room, private bathroom, you know, whereas here, you get like dingy dorm room, like a roommate, you’ve never met, things like that. There is also a tiny, like, increase in quality of life. But it’d be something like 20k, maybe for like the whole cost of it. Yeah, tuition, I think tuition and I’m not sure about room and board. I also have a sort of like, Grant, because my parents work at the United Nations. So the UN, the United Nations covers a part of my education. So that that also means I don’t have the best grasp on how much it would cost because it cost me close to zero in the UK, because of everything. Whereas in the US they cover maybe like 30k, and then my parents pay the rest. The school

Kamila
amazing, so yeah, so kids of people who work at the United Nations get some sort of discount?

Margherita
Um, depends on your parents contract. But in my mom’s contract, yeah, there is like a grant. Yeah.

Kamila
Well, that’s incredible. Okay, let’s go into the American schools that you apply to, can you first list the schools that you’re applying to? And what were you kind of looking for in a school in an American school?

Margherita
Um, I just, I didn’t pay software. I thought I would be happy. So I did, or did that. But I applied to brown, Columbia, Stanford, Harvard, and Georgetown.

Kamila
Do you have any safeties?

Margherita
Manchester Oh, Manchester

Kamila
was your safety?

Margherita
Yeah, I got in really early. Like in October, I already had my acceptance. So I was like, if I don’t get into any US ones, I’ll just go to Manchester.

Kamila
So you were perfectly like kind of willing to go to the UK? Because all those schools that you mentioned, they’re really, really selective. So you were like fine with getting going into the UK.

Margherita
I also was very, I don’t have logicals. I think people think I’m crazy. But I think I’m kind of reasonable. I calculated my, the chances that I got denied by all five of those schools. So like if you take their rejection rate, if you Yeah, if you take the rejection rate. So if there’s a 5% acceptance rate, the rejection rate is like 95. And then you multiply all of those five rejecting change rates. You get, like the chances of you getting rejected by all of those schools, and that I think I came up with something like I had a 20% chance of getting rejected. I oh five. So I had an 80% chance of getting into at least one of those schools. And I was like, those are pretty good chances. Well, where

Kamila
did you get your math from?

Margherita
It works out just basically, if you calculate the rejection, the likelihood of getting rejected by all five was relatively low was like 20%. So I was like, huh, I have like an 80% chance of getting into at least one.

Kamila
That’s incredible. Okay, so let’s go on to your actual college application. Did you apply common app for everything? Yeah. Okay. And what did you write your big essay about? What you said is much different than the UK is, is where you just list your accomplishments?

Margherita
Yeah, I wrote it about being multilingual. So I speak English and French and Spanish and Italian and I wrote it about how like, an every language I have a tiny bit of an accent or I get some words wrong word, change a couple things. And so I never fit in, in any culture. But how that also by not fitting in, I get to experience so much of the world, yada, yada. Something like I was able to embrace my voice even though as a kid, I got made fun of it.

Kamila
We went to a French school, didn’t you?

Margherita
Yeah, I wasn’t French. I had a really thick Spanish accent when I was little, and I couldn’t speak French the first years. Yeah, I wouldn’t even say my name because my name is Margarita, which in Spanish is Madame Vinita and an in French, and I couldn’t make sound. So people would ask me what my name was. And I just showed up. Really stupid, but I just didn’t want to say it.

Kamila
Do you speak? French? Spanish, Italian in English?

Margherita
Yeah. So that was like my big essay thing. Oh, wow. Okay.

Kamila
You So you grew up? So your parents are completely different? You grew up learning both Spanish and Italian? Yeah, Spanish with my mom and tell him my dad. Okay, are the languages very similar? Because I’m learning Spanish right? Now, they are very similar.

Margherita
If you you’ll probably be able to understand the other if you speak one of them, or if you’ve studied them.

Kamila
Okay, so now let’s get on to, I guess we can say last thing is recommendation letters before we find out which schools you got accepted into. So recommendation letters. I don’t know how did your school handle them? Who did you get them from? Did you have like a guidance counselor that gave everyone a recommendation letter.

Margherita
I just asked two of my teachers. One of them was actually a French teacher. And that letter was written in French and had to get translated professionally. So I just asked to the teachers that I like, I didn’t put a ton of thought into it. I just was like, Oh, I like these two teachers the best we asked them. Yeah, I didn’t put a ton of thought into it other than choosing the ones I really liked and cared for. So those are the people you should ask the ones who actually care for you and want to see you succeed.

Kamila
Okay, so which of the five you said five schools that you apply to which ones did you get accepted, differ and rejected from?

Margherita
So I got into Brown and Georgetown, I got waitlisted, a Columbia. And then I got, I applied early to Stanford was deferred and then rejected and then I got rejected from Harvard. So two and a half out of five.

Kamila
And how did you choose? Between the schools I got accepted into in America, how did you make your decision on which one you went to?

Margherita
Um, so I didn’t want to stay in New York because I didn’t really care about Columbia, I don’t think I accepted my spot on the waitlist I didn’t even accepted. And then I was picking between Georgetown and brown. And, um, there’s a couple of reasons why I chose brown one of them was honestly the money Brown was $10,000, less expensive, per year, per year. Yeah. Um, another one was, I saw like this list, I went to the admit, students weekends, and I saw this list and brown topped the list of like, the happiest students in the world, in the United States. And then I went to Georgetown, and there was a lot of talk about how there’s a lot of stress culture and like, lack of sleep, etc. And I was like, Well, what would I rather be overworked or happy and I was like, I want to be happy. So let me go to brown. Um, and also, I had the thought process, I got into the School of Foreign Service at Georgetown. And I kind of had a little moment where I was like, I’m probably going to do politics and live in DC at some other point in my life. I don’t need to spend my college years here. Let me go somewhere different, like a nice campus, kind of nowhere, like now’s the time to do something different. And so yeah, I just like brown. I thought people were nice, and they’re really nice, happy, talkative. You can feel happy when you’re around campus. So I chose and it’s also less expensive. Oh, and also a really big thing. I looked at the Georgetown dorms, and they were really bad. Like there’s there’s this account that is called at Georgetown trash I don’t know what it is anymore something like that and it’s just pictures of like floods garbage over spills bugs like terrible terrible and I was like I cannot to live in a place where like if you look it up there’s even articles from Georgetown’s like newspaper that’s like mold collapsing ceilings. There was just so bad that I was like I get these environments even on the day that I went which was like Parents Weekend like their big sell they they it was like a bug which I know is not that big of a deal but like a I have a really big phobia of bugs and be it’s like cleanest the dorms will ever be the weekend where parents come and they’re trying to sell the schools and I didn’t want it’s not it’s cleanest

Kamila
that ends part one of my interview with Margarita make sure to subscribe so you know when Part Two comes out, check out my blog called Reality Check calm down in the description for more college related content. But other than that, I hope to see you in the next