Transcript
Kamila
Hey college kids, just a few things here in the description box or whatever the description box is called for a podcast.
Kamila
I’ve linked Doctor Frindle website in house test prep if you want to go check it out.
Kamila
Also, next week I’ll be releasing an interview with Michelle who is currently attending or she just got into Harvard and this is her first year and.
Kamila
It was my first Harvard interview.
Kamila
Finally got someone willing to come on and be interviewed.
Kamila
So that’ll be released next week as part one, and then the week after will be Part 2.
Kamila
So subscribe so you do not miss that and enjoy the episode.
Kamila
Hey college kids, welcome back to my podcast who cares about College in today’s episode, I’m interviewing Dr Frindle, so if you could introduce yourself.
Dr. Frindell
Hi, I’m doctor Kelly Frindle and I’ve been teaching test prep for about the last 20 years. I’ve been working with students for the S80 and the AC T and helping students get ready for college.
Kamila
Alright, so let’s jump in right into act.
Kamila
First question is, even though many schools are not requiring it or are still uncertain about whether they’re going to have any testing in the future, why should people take it?
Kamila
This is really important, like.
Kamila
Why should we still?
Kamila
Take the SATACT.
Dr. Frindell
Yes, and that is a good question because right now there is a lot of uncertainty about what is happening with the S80 and a CT with college.
Dr. Frindell
Admissions so that first year of college, excuse me, the first year of COVID, most colleges did drop the requirements for tests because the tests weren’t being offered.
Dr. Frindell
And then some schools said they were going to be test optional for a few years.
Dr. Frindell
Some went completely test optional.
Dr. Frindell
The University of California school system went totally test blind, which means they don’t look at tests at all.
Dr. Frindell
But what it turns out is that.
Dr. Frindell
A lot of the schools that say their.
Dr. Frindell
Test optional are kind of test.
Dr. Frindell
Optional in name only.
Dr. Frindell
And So what people are finding out is even though they’re saying you don’t have to submit the.
Dr. Frindell
Scores it is actually to most.
Dr. Frindell
People’s advantage to go ahead and submit scores to a lot of schools and this is still changing quite a bit.
Dr. Frindell
And so a lot of the schools originally had a three-year timeline and that three-year timeline is coming to an end in the next year or so and schools are going to be making different decisions and some schools have actually already gone back to requiring school scores like MIT.
Dr. Frindell
Has decided they’re going to require scores from now going into the future, and so it’s tempting to say, oh, I don’t have to take it.
Dr. Frindell
All these schools are test optional, and some of them legitimately are, but plenty of them you still really.
Dr. Frindell
Do need test.
Dr. Frindell
Scores and it besides the admissions part, a lot of scholarships and merit aid are still based on scores as well.
Dr. Frindell
And so not taking tests and not having those scores available can keep you out of accessing those scholarships.
Kamila
And one thing like this test optional is beneficial for some students ’cause they just some people just can’t do standardized testing.
Kamila
So, and because of this, I think people are like, oh, I need a really high score.
Kamila
If I want to submit.
Kamila
How do you know when your score will help you versus hurt you because you would presume like the people with the highest scores are only submitting?
Kamila
People with like mid range are not really submitting any.
Kamila
Or so at what point do you know like I should actually submit my super score or not?
Great. And I don’t.
Dr. Frindell
Deal with the admission side of things.
Dr. Frindell
I mostly just do test prep, but I’ve been talking to a lot of educational consultants who do that side of things.
Dr. Frindell
And what they’ve told me is generally, if you fall within at least the 50th percentile of scores for the school, and scores are available, you can find them easily on the Internet if you just Google the name of your school.
Dr. Frindell
And 50th percentile SA T or AC T will tell you.
Dr. Frindell
Where the median score.
Dr. Frindell
And if you’re generally in that range or above, it does seem to make sense to submit your scores and.
Dr. Frindell
Different schools have different requirements and different score ranges and so.
Dr. Frindell
For one school.
Dr. Frindell
It may make sense to estimate your scores, but for a more selective school it it might potentially be better not to submit them.
Dr. Frindell
And so it is.
Dr. Frindell
It is individual and case by case.
Dr. Frindell
But if you’re generally in about the middle or above, it’s worth it to submit your score.
Kamila
All right, so let’s get into scholarships.
Kamila
One thing before you get into like S 18, what you can do with that with the PSAT.
Kamila
I think most people know when they take it.
Kamila
Like, I think junior year.
Kamila
Yeah, this one, I took it that it’s for national merit.
Kamila
You reach a certain benchmark, you qualify and you keep going semi finalists, whatever, right?
Kamila
But besides that, can you use your PSAT?
Kamila
For anything else, just a quick question.
Dr. Frindell
Not really, no.
Dr. Frindell
So the PCT is typically given junior year.
Dr. Frindell
Some schools have their students take it earlier.
Dr. Frindell
I have a lot of students who take it in 10th grade, occasionally in 9th grade and.
Dr. Frindell
Junior year is the year that the scores count for national merit and about, I think it’s around 1% of people qualify potentially for national merit.
Dr. Frindell
And the score is just the first part.
Dr. Frindell
There’s a whole bunch of other steps you have to take after that.
Dr. Frindell
You have to validate it with an essay T.
Dr. Frindell
Score later and.
Dr. Frindell
So in the past, national merit.
Dr. Frindell
Was a really good.
Dr. Frindell
Scholarship at a lot of schools.
Dr. Frindell
But in the past ten years or so, a lot of that merit aid has dropped out, and so many schools don’t even offer it at all.
Dr. Frindell
Some schools will offer you just a very small scholarship, and if you’re looking at very selective schools, most of those students are going to be national merit scholars anyway, and so it’s it’s not necessarily something that is super special.
Dr. Frindell
But it it.
Dr. Frindell
Can be helpful.
Dr. Frindell
It’s a good designation.
Dr. Frindell
To have it looks good on your.
Dr. Frindell
Resume, but that is the main thing that it is used for.
Dr. Frindell
The other thing that it is useful for though is to demonstrate interest to college to different colleges because you can elect to send information about your scores just kind of generally out there into the college world and schools can contact you based on your.
Dr. Frindell
Interests, and so some people like it for that reason.
Dr. Frindell
But other than national merit, aid is mostly just a practice exam for most people.
Kamila
OK, so now we can move onto SATACT and like what you can do with that?
Kamila
So I’ll let you take it from here. Like what scholarship opportunities are available for SATACT?
Dr. Frindell
So a lot of that is school dependent, but especially a lot of the state schools have very clear criteria.
Dr. Frindell
If you get this particular score on an essay T or AC T, you qualify for scholarships.
Dr. Frindell
So like in Florida I know they have scholarship called bright scholars and if you reach a certain level on those, you automatically qualify for scholarships.
Dr. Frindell
And different states have different criteria like that as well and so.
Dr. Frindell
Especially if you know.
Dr. Frindell
You’re going to a state school and they have criteria like that.
Dr. Frindell
It can be really worth spending the time and energy.
Dr. Frindell
Give money to get your score up, because sometimes just a small investment can lead to a really large scholarship and they can make a significant difference for people.
Dr. Frindell
And the individual.
Dr. Frindell
Schools have their own criteria, and there are also independent scholarships as well, and a lot of those are based on scores.
Kamila
And I don’t know if you’ll notice or not ’cause there’s more on, like the financial aid side for school, but like for schools that are not state schools that don’t have the clear cut requirements, but they do give merit aid.
Kamila
Maybe you have like more selective schools that give merit aid.
Kamila
Like, how dependent is your merit aid on your SATACT score? Like, do you think it contributes a lot? Maybe for like the more upper schools?
Speaker 1
From from what I’ve.
Dr. Frindell
Heard this scores do factor in pretty heavily, often intermarried, and again that isn’t my area so I’m not as well versed in.
Dr. Frindell
It but I do.
Dr. Frindell
What I have heard is that at the very selective schools, merit aid is sometimes harder to come by because everybody qualifies for it, and so often some some of the higher level.
Dr. Frindell
People don’t even offer very much merit aid at all because all of their students are excellent and it’s it’s difficult to distinguish people on those characteristics.
Kamila
Alright, so.
Kamila
Another question, probably yes or no answer is can you use your SA T or AC T for any outside scholarships that are not any like institutional forms of aid?
Dr. Frindell
You can and so.
Dr. Frindell
A lot of organizations in the communities offer scholarships, and sometimes they’re smaller scholarships, so they might be $500.00 or $1000.
Dr. Frindell
But several small scholarships can add up to big money, and a lot of those because they’re not involved necessarily in edge.
Dr. Frindell
They might be like a Rotary.
Dr. Frindell
Group or a church?
Dr. Frindell
Group or a religious group.
Dr. Frindell
They use scores as an easy way to ring people and compare people, and quite a few of those scholarships still are using scores as as a basis for choosing the scholarships.
Kamila
OK.
Kamila
And would you recommend just like going on Google, finding like scholarship search engines and just going from there?
Dr. Frindell
Yeah, and so if.
Dr. Frindell
You Google scholarship for your sports, or for your religion, or for any activities you’re in, or even your.
Dr. Frindell
Town you’ll find stuff.
Dr. Frindell
And there are directories.
Dr. Frindell
I don’t know one offhand that I can tell you, but there are directories of.
Dr. Frindell
Scholarships and generally.
Dr. Frindell
Some of those directories ask you to pay money.
Dr. Frindell
For them in.
Dr. Frindell
General, you should not pay.
Dr. Frindell
Money for a directory of scholarships.
Dr. Frindell
You can usually find most of that information for free and other sources.
Kamila
Yeah, and all like.
Kamila
Put some scholarship websites down, like the description ’cause.
Kamila
I know there are a lot of free ones that actually works.
Kamila
Like, yeah, you should not be paying anything you’re paying for.
Kamila
I don’t wouldn’t trust that.
Dr. Frindell
Right, yeah.
Dr. Frindell
All of that information is freely available elsewhere.
Kamila
OK, so next let’s talk more specifically about we can talk about safety strategies and the ACC ’cause, they’re two completely different tests.
Kamila
So let’s start with that.
Kamila
So for both the math section and then the English section, what strategies would you recommend and like how to approach it when you’re starting to prepare?
Dr. Frindell
So for the math section, especially after these last few kovid years, one of the things that I really recommend before you even get started with the actual prep is brushing up on just your standard math skills.
Dr. Frindell
And because on the S80 there is a note calculator section, you do need to know your times tables. You need to know how to do long division by hand.
Dr. Frindell
You need to know how to find percents and decimals and that sort.
Dr. Frindell
Of thing and what I’ve found is.
Dr. Frindell
Quite a few students have for either forgotten.
Dr. Frindell
No skills or they never learn them because everybody.
Dr. Frindell
Missed so much math.
Dr. Frindell
In those early years of Kovid and so the first thing I have people do and it seems kind of silly to be studying times tables when you’re a junior.
Dr. Frindell
But if you don’t know your times tables, it is really difficult to do the essay T math section with no calculator.
Dr. Frindell
And so that’s the first thing I have people do is.
Dr. Frindell
Study the basics.
Dr. Frindell
Get brushed up again on their timetables, relearn math formulas, relearn math vocab.
Dr. Frindell
Three, and then once you have that basic foundation, then you can start into working on the problems and for S80.
Dr. Frindell
The math, especially, is its own version of tricky necessity.
Dr. Frindell
Math is very weird, and it is not really the standard way that you might learn in school and.
Dr. Frindell
So learning there, there are resources that you can seek out.
Dr. Frindell
Khan Academy has some good free videos.
Dr. Frindell
There’s plenty of stuff on the Internet you can.
Dr. Frindell
Get a book.
Dr. Frindell
But it is worth it to learn some of the strategies for the math section because they are not intuitive and if nobody tells you them or you aren’t exposed to them in some way, there are few students who will just naturally get them.
Dr. Frindell
But I found for most people it isn’t intuitive at all and they do need to learn those things.
Dr. Frindell
But the good news about the asset map and.
Dr. Frindell
This is true for all of test prep for all.
Dr. Frindell
The tests, the material is highly predictable. It is the same stuff over and over and over again, and so I usually have my students use the official books for S80.
Dr. Frindell
It’s a big giant blue book with about 1300 pages in it. It’s got 10 practice tests, and that information is actually freely available on the Internet as well. From Khan Academy. They provide those tests.
Dr. Frindell
And for the English section, the English is the grammar part, and for that I really recommend that people review grammar rules first.
Dr. Frindell
Just like I haven’t reviewed the math skills, I haven’t reviewed grammar rules.
Dr. Frindell
I’m finding that a lot of students don’t know how to use semi colons.
Dr. Frindell
They don’t know how to use a dash, they.
Dr. Frindell
Don’t know what.
Dr. Frindell
A colons for and.
Dr. Frindell
They may have known, but they don’t remember.
Dr. Frindell
Or again, they may have just missed that in these last few years, so a good grammar review at the beginning is important, and then going through the material over and over again through practice problems is also.
Dr. Frindell
A really key step, because like I was saying earlier, this stuff is predictable and most of test prep is just pattern recognition.
Dr. Frindell
And the way you get better at patterns.
Dr. Frindell
Is to see them and do them, and the more problems you can do, the better.
Dr. Frindell
But what’s really important too is, as you’re doing, practice problems.
Dr. Frindell
I have a lot of students.
Dr. Frindell
Come to me and they say, Oh well, I worked through.
Dr. Frindell
All the the problems in the book and I said, well, did you check your answers?
Dr. Frindell
Did you see?
Dr. Frindell
What you missed?
Dr. Frindell
And they say well.
Dr. Frindell
No, and just doing problems.
Dr. Frindell
Without reviewing what you’ve missed and seeing those patterns and learning where your weaknesses, solar isn’t really very useful.
Kamila
OK, OK. And you skipped on UH-1 very important for us STEM kids. How do you do the reading?
Kamila
Message is not too late for me, but Oh my God.
Dr. Frindell
Yes, and the the reading.
Dr. Frindell
Passages are I find are one of the harder sections to improve and.
Dr. Frindell
It called it.
Dr. Frindell
Part of the issue with that is test prep.
Dr. Frindell
Reading skills are not necessarily the same as reading comprehension skills, and so there are strategies for dealing with the reading.
Dr. Frindell
Sections about how fast treated and which questions to do first and that sort of thing.
Dr. Frindell
And also there there are strategies within this section.
Dr. Frindell
So there are keywords that often tip you off that in answer choices wrong making if it has extreme words in it.
Dr. Frindell
If it has words like all or must or never, that’s usually a red flag that an answer.
Dr. Frindell
Is wrong, and so there there are some test strategies like that and how to go back to the passage and read around where they tell you.
Dr. Frindell
But one of.
Dr. Frindell
The challenging things with test prep is helping people be better readers because it just isn’t geared necessarily towards helping you.
Dr. Frindell
Be a better reader.
Dr. Frindell
It’s helping you to take the reading section on a test better.
Dr. Frindell
And so that that is a little bit of a more complicated answer because the answer really starts go back in the past five years ago and start reading a lot.
Dr. Frindell
And so for students who are younger, that’s really what I recommend is read as much.
Dr. Frindell
As you can, and read as many sources you can.
Dr. Frindell
Read the news, read you know, read the back of the cereal box.
Dr. Frindell
Read things on the Internet.
Dr. Frindell
Find good books to read.
Dr. Frindell
Because once you do, get to your junior year.
Dr. Frindell
Reading it is challenging thing to to change your.
Dr. Frindell
Skill level not.
Kamila
And I’ll just say something as someone who’s taking the S80.
Kamila
Twice my scores are released tomorrow.
Kamila
My second says I’m waiting, but uh, yeah, reading for me it’s that’s the worst section by far.
Kamila
And I’ll say like the answer is in the passage, you should not be interpreting anything like Reddit Digest, understand, don’t make any assumptions, don’t make any interpretations.
Kamila
’cause the.
Kamila
It’s going to.
Kamila
Very clearly state what the answer is.
Dr. Frindell
Right, and and and that.
Kamila
I think people.
Kamila
That’s what I.
Kamila
Did in here.
Dr. Frindell
That’s something I have to tell my students too, is there is no outside knowledge required or needed on the reading section.
Dr. Frindell
And so you shouldn’t, even if you know that topic very well, ’cause, sometimes you’ll get a topic you’re like, Oh yeah, I just studied this in school.
Dr. Frindell
Or this is something I’m super interested?
Dr. Frindell
In and you.
Dr. Frindell
Do not want to put any of your own.
Dr. Frindell
Interpretation in it and so typically if it’s.
Dr. Frindell
A detailed question.
Dr. Frindell
You should be able to point to.
Dr. Frindell
Something in the passage that says here is exactly that answer, and it will be worded differently.
Dr. Frindell
But there should be something you can point to, and for the questions I ask you to infer things or to think about what the author was feeling or something.
Dr. Frindell
Even though there may not be an exact place you can point to, there’s still an idea in there and you’re not just making up something.
Kamila
On your.
Kamila
Yeah, you you never.
Kamila
That was my mistake on the first time, it was like making up stuff and.
Kamila
I was like but no.
Kamila
So let’s move on to a CT.
Kamila
I also took the AC, T was not.
Kamila
That good for.
Kamila
Me, but anyways, so can you quickly explain how the ACT differs from the S80 and then?
Kamila
And again, like tips and advice for each section, yes.
Dr. Frindell
So the ECT and the essay T.
Dr. Frindell
They used to be very different from each other.
Dr. Frindell
They’ve become more similar over the years, and so there aren’t as many differences as they used to be.
Dr. Frindell
The essay T has four sections.
Dr. Frindell
It’s got a reading comprehension section in English section, which is grammar the math now.
Dr. Frindell
Calculator and the math calculator section, ECT.
Dr. Frindell
Also has four sections, but they’re slightly different.
Dr. Frindell
It has a reading comprehension, it has the English for the grammar.
Dr. Frindell
It has one math section which you can use a calculator for.
Dr. Frindell
All of it.
Dr. Frindell
And then it also has a science.
Dr. Frindell
Section and the the Reading and the English are fairly similar to the S80 reading and English. There’s there are some structural differences, but in general the content is.
Kamila
It’s a bit more fast-paced, the writing, yes. Yeah, that one’s more fast-paced.
Dr. Frindell
Yes, the timing on the ACT is indeed harder than the S80. You have fewer seconds per question, but the content tends to be a little bit more straightforward, and so with the math section there is only one mass section. You can use a calculator for it.
Dr. Frindell
But I do find that that the AC TMAP is more like the stuff that you’re used to learning in school and it’s largely just here’s a problem, do it and SAT math is more find this really tricky way to do.
Speaker 3
This and then do that, and then take the reciprocal of.
Dr. Frindell
It and then do this.
Dr. Frindell
And that is not a way you’ve learned in school, ECT.
Dr. Frindell
Math is mostly.
Dr. Frindell
Did you learn this stuff?
Dr. Frindell
School or not?
Dr. Frindell
And in that way, it’s a little bit easier to prepare for. This science section tends to be the wild card for a lot of people, because there’s no equivalent on the S80.
Dr. Frindell
And the science section is an interesting section because it’s about science, but you don’t really need to know science to do it because what they do.
Dr. Frindell
Is they give you about.
Dr. Frindell
Six different experiments, and the experiments can be about anything.
Dr. Frindell
They can be biology or physics or chemistry.
Dr. Frindell
And they give you data.
Dr. Frindell
And some information about the study that they conducted and largely it’s a data interpretation.
Dr. Frindell
Kind of.
Dr. Frindell
So you are finding information from the charts.
Dr. Frindell
You’re making inferences about the hypotheses that they give you.
Dr. Frindell
You might be describing the procedure that they did and understanding the steps of the scientific method.
Dr. Frindell
There are a couple of questions.
Dr. Frindell
There’s 40 questions on the science and typically about.
Dr. Frindell
Two to three of.
Dr. Frindell
Them might be outside knowledge type questions where?
Dr. Frindell
You do need to know a little bit.
Dr. Frindell
What about they often ask about the pH scale, or photosynthesis, or scientific method steps, but largely, since it’s just about science, you don’t need to sit down and learn science necessarily.
Dr. Frindell
So it’s not like you need to memorize the periodic table.
Dr. Frindell
You don’t have to learn chemistry formulas, you’re just you’re doing a section about science and.
Dr. Frindell
Often when people see that one the first time, it tends to freak a lot of people out.
Dr. Frindell
So like, what was this?
Dr. Frindell
I don’t know what to do with it, but that section is also pretty learnable and pretty coachable as well.
Dr. Frindell
And that one in particular is a good one to spend a lot of time with just.
Dr. Frindell
Changed lots of sections and left the practice.
Dr. Frindell
Sections of it because.
Dr. Frindell
That’s the only way to get better at it, since it is so different from other types of testing items.
Kamila
And with the students that you’ve worked with, like.
Kamila
Would do you notice like certain students are better with the SAT and certain students are better?
Kamila
With the act.
Dr. Frindell
I have seen some patterns.
Dr. Frindell
What I’ve noticed is that students.
Dr. Frindell
Who are good at?
Dr. Frindell
Tests tend to be.
Dr. Frindell
Better tips tend to.
Dr. Frindell
Be fine at both tests.
Dr. Frindell
They they.
Dr. Frindell
Will usually score well.
But for.
Dr. Frindell
A lot of test takers at who really struggle with tests I found.
Dr. Frindell
Personally I found that asked is often a little bit easier of a test to study for, and the timing is harder that that is true.
Dr. Frindell
But sometimes it doesn’t matter, especially for people who are kind of middle level test takers.
Dr. Frindell
A lot of the really hard questions.
Dr. Frindell
Which often at the end, they’re so hard that those are students who are probably not going to get those questions right anyway.
Dr. Frindell
And so if they don’t have quite enough time to finish everything, often it doesn’t matter because there’s some of the questions that are being.
Dr. Frindell
On their level anyway.
Dr. Frindell
And for me personally, a lot of the students I work with have extended time for various learning differences or ADHD or anxiety.
Dr. Frindell
And so the timing on the actie with extended time is is reasonably manageable and there are ways to manage it if you have the regular time for it and.
Dr. Frindell
For a lot.
Dr. Frindell
Of students like.
Dr. Frindell
We’re talking about earlier. The math on the S80 is so tricky that if you are not good at math to begin with or you struggle with.
Dr. Frindell
It is often hard.
Dr. Frindell
To learn how to do math in the essay T way, because it is.
Dr. Frindell
Its own thing.
Dr. Frindell
And so it’s it’s interesting.
Kamila
Not a good way.
I I love.
Dr. Frindell
ICT math.
Dr. Frindell
I think it’s fun and I’ve met a few people who like it too, but for.
Dr. Frindell
A lot of people.
Dr. Frindell
It’s just kind of torture and.
Dr. Frindell
So often people.
Dr. Frindell
Find it a little easier to study for a CT, but it is individual and the way that I determine which tests we should prepare for ’cause in general use.
Dr. Frindell
Pick one and prepare for it, because it’s hard to to split your energy between both of them.
Dr. Frindell
I usually just have people take a practice test and practice 80 into practice act, and sometimes there are clear differences that, OK, this one is clearly better than the other one.
Dr. Frindell
And if that’s.
Speaker 3
The case you.
Dr. Frindell
Should always go with that one, because there’s no reason to work hard to.
Dr. Frindell
Pull your lower score.
Dr. Frindell
Just up to get up to where.
Dr. Frindell
Your other one is when you could just improve the other one to begin with.
Dr. Frindell
If they are reasonably similar to each other, which happens sometimes, then I usually talk with the student and see what their own preferences were.
Dr. Frindell
Because some people are very clear, I want nothing to do with the HCT or I want nothing to do.
Dr. Frindell
With the S80.
Dr. Frindell
And if they have a preference and their scores are about.
Dr. Frindell
Equal and I’m happy to.
Dr. Frindell
Go with that one and the.
Dr. Frindell
The good thing is preparing for one of them.
Dr. Frindell
Mostly prepares you for the other one anyway, because the content does overlap so much now, and so a fair number of my students may end up taking the other test at some point anyway, because the work that we’ve done will help.
Dr. Frindell
Them with the other one ending.
Kamila
All right. So we’ve talked about asked, we’ll come back to like studying tips, but we’re going to talk about another test, which is the S80 and the E, which are like boarding school magnet, like those kind of schools that require a test selling just like a public school. So I’m going to let you take it from here, like what are those?
Kamila
Test UM.
Kamila
Do are they like standardized, like the SATACT, or do they vary school by school?
Dr. Frindell
Yes, so the S80 and the IE are standardized tests. They’re they’re like bsat in the act, but they’re for students who are looking to go to boarding schools or private schools, and typically people take them usually in either 5th grade or 8th grade, typically looking to enter into 6th grade for middle school or 9th grade for high school.
Dr. Frindell
And the tests do.
Dr. Frindell
Have some similarities to SAT&A.
Dr. Frindell
CT they’re structured sort of the same way and they have the same importance and for both of those tests they they cover pretty similar material.
Dr. Frindell
They have vocabulary on them, they have reading comprehension, and then they also have math.
Dr. Frindell
And because they are given to younger students, you cannot use a calculator on either.
Dr. Frindell
Those tests, and so those skills we were talking about earlier, the multiplication and the division and percents and fractions, those are all super important to know.
Dr. Frindell
To be able to to work on.
Dr. Frindell
Those tests and vocabulary.
Dr. Frindell
Turns out to be a huge part as well.
Dr. Frindell
So on the SSA T, they have synonyms where they just give you a word and then they give you 5 answer choices and you pick one that’s similar.
Dr. Frindell
And they also have analogies, which a lot of students have not seen.
Dr. Frindell
They used to be more common, but they’ve been taken off a lot of tests, so things like.
Dr. Frindell
Kitten is to.
Dr. Frindell
Cat as and then you can like puppy is to dog and those are largely dependent.
Dr. Frindell
There’s some there’s some test prep tricks for those, but those are largely dependent on do you know this word or not.
Dr. Frindell
And so for those tests, sending vocabulary is a tremendously important thing.
Dr. Frindell
So I have my students.
Dr. Frindell
Studying flash cards and.
Dr. Frindell
List of high frequency words and for the essay T there used to be a lot of vocabulary on the CT, so I always had my student study vocabulary as well and luckily now you don’t have to.
Dr. Frindell
But for these younger tests you you do and the same for the.
Dr. Frindell
I see they also have synonyms, and then they have what are called sentence completions where they give you a sentence with a blank.
Dr. Frindell
And you are using context clues to fill in the appropriate vocabulary word for those, and the the strategies from studying for those tests are very similar to SAT&ACT. You need the basic math skills.
Dr. Frindell
For those ones, you do need to study vocabulary and then for the reading comprehension the same issue As for the older tests.
Dr. Frindell
You can learn the test prep strategies, but it is difficult to increase your comprehension and your reading speed in a short amount of time, and so those are things that are best worked on in previous years leading to the test.
Kamila
And one quick question before we keep going.
Kamila
What’s the difference between the SSA and the IE?
Dr. Frindell
So the they’re basically from two different companies, so just like SAT&ACT or two different companies, it’s the same thing?
Dr. Frindell
And so different schools want or accept different scores, but they’re they’re largely similar to each other.
Dr. Frindell
They’re just two different companies.
Kamila
OK, so.
Kamila
We’re good with that.
Kamila
We can go into like more study tips now.
Kamila
So we can answer.
Kamila
Can you answer for both S ATT and then?
Kamila
As I say, T i.e.
Kamila
Maybe this is more for parents so they know or maybe students to how long from the test date should you start studying and also.
Kamila
So is there like a better time of the year to like choose a test date like do you think there are some test dates like, oh, it’s better for you to do it this time ’cause you have less stress this time.
Kamila
So like, how do you choose a test date?
Kamila
And then how far from the test date should you start studying?
Dr. Frindell
Prepare, yes, and that is a good question to think about because you do want to start putting things in place early, because if you wait too long it makes everything so much harder to try to scramble and get everything fit in very quickly. And so for my high school students for SAT and A/C.
Dr. Frindell
T there are differing opinions about this, but I personally usually like to have my students take at least something by the end of the fall of their junior year.
Dr. Frindell
So by by December or so of junior year, I like to see people have at least one test under.
Dr. Frindell
Their belt and the reason?
Dr. Frindell
This is because it leaves plenty of time to take a second.
Dr. Frindell
Tests, and most students will end up taking a test a second.
Dr. Frindell
Time and it’s fine to do that.
Dr. Frindell
There’s no problem in doing that.
Dr. Frindell
And that allows people to either take.
Dr. Frindell
It in spring or.
Dr. Frindell
Potentially in the summer before their junior year.
Dr. Frindell
But there are some people who say wait until the spring of your junior year, and for a lot of students that’s probably fine.
Dr. Frindell
But for me I I feel more comfortable doing it a little bit.
Dr. Frindell
Earlier so that people have more options and some of that actually is dependent too on what math class people are taking.
Dr. Frindell
If students are just in Algebra 2 during their junior year, they may want to wait a little bit more towards the spring because there is quite a bit of Algebra 2 material on both tests.
Dr. Frindell
But if people are already in Precal as juniors, it doesn’t matter as much because they’ve had the material they need.
Dr. Frindell
For the test.
Dr. Frindell
And typically I recommend starting probably somewhere between three to six months before you’re going to take a first Test to study.
Dr. Frindell
And some of that is.
Dr. Frindell
Dependent on where people are starting out and a practice test can give you a good idea of where you’re starting out.
Dr. Frindell
So if you take a practice test sometime towards the end of your trip, excuse me, towards the end of your sophomore year or maybe that early summer before junior year, that can give you a little bit of a clue to how much time you.
Dr. Frindell
Need to be.
Dr. Frindell
Spending for things but it.
Dr. Frindell
It’s months, I.
Dr. Frindell
Don’t usually recommend years.
Dr. Frindell
There are some people who like to start with their kids in 9th grade.
Dr. Frindell
And keep doing.
Dr. Frindell
It and I just, I, I don’t believe in that particularly one because there’s they will burn out.
Dr. Frindell
That is a long time to prepare for a test for two the tests are about to change anyway. The S80 is going to be changing in the next year and a half, and it’s three it is. It’s going digital.
It is.
Kamila
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
Dr. Frindell
In spring of 24 and so yes, and that will change everything. So any studying that people are doing right now, if they’re younger than 10th or 11th grade, they’re going to be taking an entirely different test.
Kamila
I got an.
Kamila
E-mail about that.
Dr. Frindell
Anyway, and so I typically.
Dr. Frindell
Don’t recommend starting that early.
Dr. Frindell
It’s OK to practice math skills and reading skills and.
Dr. Frindell
And a lot of things along those lines, but I don’t recommend full prep at that time.
Dr. Frindell
And for the for.
Dr. Frindell
The SSA and I see pretty similar.
Dr. Frindell
Those tests are usually offered mostly in the fall because of how the admission cycle work, and with those students I usually recommend they.
Dr. Frindell
Start around.
Dr. Frindell
Somewhere between June and August before.
Dr. Frindell
They take the test.
Dr. Frindell
In late fall.
Kamila
Alright, so another thing is, let’s say you choose three months before your city.
Kamila
Like let’s say you choose whatever city and then you choose to study three months before it.
Kamila
So with within those three months, how would you kind of separate your time or like how would you like to study in those?
Kamila
Three months leading up to the test, like what is a general routine that you would give?
Dr. Frindell
So I would recommend if people are studying on their own, the thing that I would recommend highly at the beginning is make an actual plan and write it down.
Dr. Frindell
Because I I know both from having been a student and also working with students for so long. There’s so many things in so many competing interests, and SAT&ACT are not always the most fun or exciting things.
Dr. Frindell
To study for it.
Dr. Frindell
And if you don’t have an actual plan to do it.
Dr. Frindell
Yeah, I have.
Dr. Frindell
A lot of parents who hand their kid a book and I like your study this and the book ends up under the bed and.
Dr. Frindell
I think it never looks at it, and I can’t say I blame them too much.
Dr. Frindell
It’s it’s hard to to do an errand.
Dr. Frindell
So coming up with an actual plan of OK, on Tuesdays and Thursdays I’m going to spend an hour working on these things and once a month I’m going to take a practice test and or having some kind of general plan in that way to to provide.
Dr. Frindell
In structure and.
Dr. Frindell
At the beginning, like we spoke about earlier, covering those basic skills, working through practice sections and then taking some crack.
Dr. Frindell
Just tests and timing is part of it in there too.
Dr. Frindell
With my students, I usually wait till about halfway through to start working on the timing.
Dr. Frindell
Because it’s important to me that my students learn how to do things correctly 1st and learn what the tricks are and learn the skills and learn how to answer problems and once they have those down.
Dr. Frindell
Then they can start working on the time.
Dr. Frindell
And timing is a thing like reading comprehension. It’s hard to change because by the time you’re 151617, your processing speed is pretty much.
Dr. Frindell
What it is?
Dr. Frindell
And that is not going to change a lot, so I can’t people come to me now like why I can’t finish the tests, help me be able to get through it faster and I can’t always help.
Dr. Frindell
People get through it faster, but.
Dr. Frindell
What I can help them do is figure out which problems are we’re spending time on, because there are some problems that are so hard that most people are going to miss them, and if there’s a pretty high likelihood you’re going to miss a problem you shouldn’t spend 5 minutes on.
Dr. Frindell
But other question you’re going to miss anyway when you could get maybe two easier questions right in that same amount of time.
Dr. Frindell
And so part of time management is trying to work faster, but also working smarter to.
Dr. Frindell
Know what’s worth.
Dr. Frindell
It and what’s not, and some of that comes with experience and practice as well.
Kamila
And another thing is let’s say.
Kamila
Let’s say you’re really good at one section in general.
Kamila
Like like you’re a math student you’re already in like calc.
Kamila
By the time you’re in your junior year, you very well know your math.
Kamila
You don’t need a practice, but you know you’ve done a practice since you’ve gotten like, a really high score.
Kamila
Do you think it’s worth?
Kamila
Continuing to practice even if you’re like really, really, you’re solid on that, or should you just focus on the other section?
What I do in?
Dr. Frindell
That case ’cause.
Dr. Frindell
I have some students like that who are scoring almost perfect on one section and then struggling in the others.
Dr. Frindell
What I typically.
Dr. Frindell
Do when I’m working.
Dr. Frindell
With them privately, I usually have them.
Dr. Frindell
Do some of those sections at home for homework.
Dr. Frindell
And not as much as the other.
Dr. Frindell
Sections, but it is important.
Dr. Frindell
To keep working on those because if you just leave it, sometimes you you lose some of those skills.
Dr. Frindell
And so I have them do some typically on their own and then if they have questions on things we can go over those, but we don’t necessarily spend as much time together.
Dr. Frindell
On them but.
Dr. Frindell
There, sometimes people who are really skilled at math actually struggle with some of the easier questions.
Dr. Frindell
Because if you’re in calculus as a sophomore or junior.
Dr. Frindell
There there’s a.
Dr. Frindell
Fair amount of 4th and 7th grade math on the easier problems of SAT&ACT and if you haven’t done 4th or 7th grade math.
Dr. Frindell
In a lot of years, and you’re busy doing calculus, it’s easy to forget some of that stuff and so and it’s silly to lose points on easy questions because you haven’t reviewed them.
Dr. Frindell
And so there is the balance I do have people still work on them some.
Dr. Frindell
But that frees us up to focus on on the other sections and some of test prep.
Dr. Frindell
Honestly, is there’s a balance to between figuring out where am I likely to get points back and what am I weak on?
Dr. Frindell
And sometimes the things that you’re weak on you can improve to a certain extent, but it also makes sense to really focus on the places where you’re likely to.
Dr. Frindell
To get those easy points back as well.
Kamila
Alright, so my really my only last question is.
Kamila
Is to like tips to deal with test anxiety ’cause.
Kamila
You know, some people are like just not good at testing.
Kamila
And some people get really anxious, like, they can do it, but once they enter the test room, it’s like, Oh my God, it’s actually happening so.
Kamila
Can you give some like tips that students have?
Kamila
Used in the past and have been proven successful with ACC or like any of the boarding school tests.
Dr. Frindell
And what I find is something I talk with my students about all the time, and we talk about this early and.
Dr. Frindell
Often is.
Dr. Frindell
Knowing what these tests are and what they measure and what they don’t measure.
Dr. Frindell
Because a lot of people get really wound up about these tests because they’ve heard about the importance, you know, all their life.
Dr. Frindell
And this is the thing that determines.
Speaker 3
Your future and.
Dr. Frindell
It really isn’t.
Dr. Frindell
And a lot of people really think.
Dr. Frindell
SAT&ACT tests or IQ tests, so they say. How smart you.
Speaker 1
Right.
Dr. Frindell
Are and they’re not.
Dr. Frindell
They’re not IQ tests at all, and really all they measure is how well you do on this test on this day.
Dr. Frindell
And that’s it.
Dr. Frindell
And a lot of people are really caught up in thinking, Oh my test score is a measure of how smart I am or how well I’m going to do at school or if I’m a good person or not.
Dr. Frindell
And I have a lot of.
Dr. Frindell
People who come.
Dr. Frindell
To me and they, they see their very successful parents and their siblings who may be SAT that just walked into the testing room and got a.
Dr. Frindell
34 or 35?
Dr. Frindell
Out of 36 on the ACT, with no preparation, and they come to me and they say why? You know what’s wrong with me?
Dr. Frindell
Why am I?
Dr. Frindell
Why am I dumb?
Dr. Frindell
Why AM?
Dr. Frindell
I struggling with this ’cause I can’t walk in and get.
Dr. Frindell
A 34 or.
Dr. Frindell
35 and there are some people out there who can do that, but the.
Dr. Frindell
Truth is, that isn’t most of us.
Dr. Frindell
And it for most.
Dr. Frindell
People, these tests, their heart, they’re designed to be that way.
Dr. Frindell
And so just knowing at the beginning of this that it you’re not expected to know how to do all of it when you walk into the room, it is learnable, it is coachable, and it also doesn’t define your future.
Dr. Frindell
Knowing that part often calms people down.
Dr. Frindell
Little bit ’cause, I, I.
Dr. Frindell
I have a lot of students who come to me and they’re just like, I can’t do it.
Dr. Frindell
It’s too much.
Dr. Frindell
And so put it in perspective is always an important thing to do and.
Dr. Frindell
Then for the actual stress management tips for things.
Dr. Frindell
The studying is really important, so being able to make a decision to make it a priority.
Dr. Frindell
Helps with some of that stress because a lot of my students country and they just, they haven’t made the time to study and so then they they feel bad that they haven’t done their work and then it just spirals.
Dr. Frindell
If I didn’t do this OK, now I’m too scared to do this next one.
Dr. Frindell
And now three weeks.
Dr. Frindell
Have gone by and they have done nothing.
Dr. Frindell
And so having a schedule in place is helpful.
Dr. Frindell
And also I sometimes have to tell my students to some work is always better than no work.
Dr. Frindell
And so even if you have a schedule, if you.
Dr. Frindell
Get a little bit.
Dr. Frindell
Off track, do whatever you can because.
Dr. Frindell
20 minutes of math.
Dr. Frindell
Is better than no minutes of math and so.
Dr. Frindell
And you can’t.
Dr. Frindell
Learn everything, either.
Dr. Frindell
And so there there are a few special people in the world who can just take the tests and get a perfect score.
Dr. Frindell
But it it it is a very small percentage of people who can do that.
Dr. Frindell
And for everyone else, not everything on the test is going to be learnable.
Dr. Frindell
And so if you can let that go, the idea.
Dr. Frindell
That I have to know everything.
Dr. Frindell
That frees you up a little bit mentally to say, OK, I’m going to work on the.
Dr. Frindell
Things I’m strong on.
Dr. Frindell
I know there’s a couple things that aren’t intended.
Dr. Frindell
For me and I.
Dr. Frindell
Will do the best within the abilities that.
Dr. Frindell
I have because.
Dr. Frindell
Their test prep is it is successful.
Dr. Frindell
Usually, if you put the time and energy and effort into it, most people can see improvements on their score.
Dr. Frindell
There are real silly ceilings to people scores though, and there is a certain point you will hit where you really have hit your level of your score, but up until then there’s usually plenty of room for.
Dr. Frindell
Improvement, but just knowing it isn’t the end of the world.
Dr. Frindell
It isn’t everything.
Dr. Frindell
It’s important, sure, but it is.
Dr. Frindell
It is not a measure of self worth at all.
Kamila
Alright, thank you Doctor Freundl for coming on today.
Kamila
Are you in Pacific Time?
Dr. Frindell
I am actually in Hawaii and so I’m on Hawaii time.
Kamila
Oh, OK.
Kamila
So like early morning there.
Dr. Frindell
It is 9:30.
Speaker 3
Which is not too bad I’ve been doing.
Speaker 3
Meetings I’ve been doing.
Dr. Frindell
Meetings at 6, but things just happened.
Dr. Frindell
Early here, so there’s no.
Dr. Frindell
Right.
Kamila
Oh, alright, have a good rest of your day then.
Dr. Frindell
Are you are you still you’re still in high school?
Speaker 3
I hadn’t really thought, I thought.
Speaker 3
You were in college?
Kamila
Senior High School.
Speaker 3
Where are you playing?
Kamila
Oh God.
Kamila
So I live in Maryland.
Kamila
So UMBC, MD.
Kamila
Forget my schools, Drexel GWU.
Kamila
Uhm, Urbana, Champaign.
Kamila
Champaign was pronounced.
Kamila
Uhm, Pitt?
Kamila
Northeastern is like my dream school.
Kamila
I love that school to death.
Kamila
Northeastern Vanderbilt is probably like my.
Kamila
Lowest acceptance school, Georgia Tech, Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, and probably like one more than I’m forgetting.
Kamila
That’s what I thought.
Dr. Frindell
Got it.
Dr. Frindell
So where are we?
Dr. Frindell
It’s what, September, so are you just putting in applications now?
Speaker 1
Ha ha ha. Uh.
Not yet.
Kamila
It’s a process.
Kamila
It’s a lot of minor early because I can’t do ET.
Kamila
I don’t have like the financial security for e.g., but I am doing EA for everything I can, and most of them I’m going to be doing EA.
Kamila
Except for Vanderbilt and GW ’cause, they don’t offer EA so, and they’re all November 1st, so.
Kamila
I gotta get on that, you know?
Dr. Frindell
Get don’t my, my, my friendly advice for this.
Dr. Frindell
Don’t leave him till the last minute.
Dr. Frindell
It’s like test prep because it just the longer you leave them and they are painful to do, but just get him knocked out and then be done with them.
Dr. Frindell
So you could you let us eat your senior then?
Dr. Frindell
Yes, just.
Speaker 3
Get them done.
Speaker 3
Get those stupid as he’s written.
Dr. Frindell
And then enjoy the rest of your year.
Kamila
Yeah, this makes.
Kamila
Me glad to know, like in less.
Kamila
Than two months.
Kamila
All of what high school has led.
Kamila
Up to be over.
Dr. Frindell
Yes, that’s awesome.
Speaker 3
All right, well.
Speaker 3
Thank you so much.
Speaker 3
I appreciate it.
Speaker 3
This is a very admirable adventure adventure for you, so Congrats and I will look forward to it.
Speaker 3
I’ll put it on my social media and stuff.
Kamila
Alright, thank you. Enjoy Hawaii.
Dr. Frindell
Alright, thank you.
Dr. Frindell
See you.